Why don't you believe in God?

[Nabz]

It doesn't disprove anything, its simply a bridge between the creation of reality the universe and then life. Yeah cool theory, but what does it have to do with this debate.

I'm not trying to disprove anything. He asked how humans came into being so I gave him an answer that could satisfy the question. Or do you have a problem with answering questions?

Pardon me, if i couldn't phrase it properly. I asked for the source and i still haven't gotten it. Abiogenesis is a process, to be precise but what made it to occur?

Edited March 2, 2013 by shad0wboss

[Award Winning Boss]

Pardon me, if i couldn't phrase it properly. I asked for the source and i still haven't gotten it. Abiogenesis is a process, to be precise but what made it to occur?

Source of what? Where humans came from? I've told you the answer. We developed through evolution but it's difficult to say what the 'first human' was. As you probably understand. (at least I'll hope you do). If you want to know how that possibly started, read about abiogenesis. There are multiple hypotheses about it. A simple search would lead you to the wikipedia page. If you're looking for something else then I think you're going to end up regressing to the beginning of the universe.

What's difficult to understand about this?

[Luka Petrovic]

No I don't, I actually do like answers and I think thats a pretty good one for as to why life came to be on earth. I see what your saying, sorry hehe.

[Luka Petrovic]

He understand the process and is asking why, instead of how. Atheists/ rationalists hate this question saying its irrelevant. So i ask, if its such a silly question, why does the question "why" exist?

[Nabz]

Pardon me, if i couldn't phrase it properly. I asked for the source and i still haven't gotten it. Abiogenesis is a process, to be precise but what made it to occur?

Source of what? Where humans came from? I've told you the answer. We developed through evolution but it's difficult to say what the 'first human' was. As you probably understand. (at least I'll hope you do). If you want to know how that possibly started, read about abiogenesis. There are multiple hypotheses about it. A simple search would lead you to the wikipedia page. If you're looking for something else then I think you're going to end up regressing to the beginning of the universe.

What's difficult to understand about this?

No no no. I don't take Biology so i don't know much about Abiogenesis but that's really a process from where the life started from "Inorganic matter" and then the evolution took place, right? My question is, what triggered that process? Isn't it pretty much like the question behind Big Bang theory?

but anyways i won't argue much and misuse this example as i have little to no knowledge of this, although i would more than appreciate if you know the answer to that.

Edited March 2, 2013 by shad0wboss

[Luka Petrovic]

No its on a smaller level. The big bang theory is simply the creation of the universe. It says nothing particular about the creation of organic matter/ life. Abiogenesis is the creation of life from inorganic materials on earth. Essentially gases and other things from early volcanic formations caused weather, with this weather came lightening, one day a primordial soup was zapped by lightening and it created amino acids, the building blocks of life.

[Award Winning Boss]

He understand the process and is asking why, instead of how. Atheists/ rationalists hate this question saying its irrelevant. So i ask, if its such a silly question, why does the question "why" exist?

Atheism isn't synonymous with rationalism. In fact, many famous theists were rationalists and many famous atheists were empiricists.

It's just a product of our language. And wholly irrelevant to this discussion. It's like asking why does the word 'shoe' exist.

No no no. I don't take Biology so i don't know much about Abiogenesis but that's really a process from where the life started from "Inorganic matter" and then the evolution took place, right? My question is, what triggered that process? Isn't it pretty much like the question behind Big Bang theory?

What triggered evolution? Nothing 'triggered' it or ordered it to start. It's a natural process that just happens. If an animal was traits that don't help it to survive then natural selection results in the weakest dying and those with more favourable genes reproducing thus increasing the likelihood of survival.

[Luka Petrovic]

No but today we often break it into a theist/faith camp and then an atheist/ rationalist camp. In the western world, they don't reconcile much.

[Nabz]

He understand the process and is asking why, instead of how. Atheists/ rationalists hate this question saying its irrelevant. So i ask, if its such a silly question, why does the question "why" exist?

Atheism isn't synonymous with rationalism. In fact, many famous theists were rationalists and many famous atheists were empiricists.

It's just a product of our language. And wholly irrelevant to this discussion. It's like asking why does the word 'shoe' exist.

No no no. I don't take Biology so i don't know much about Abiogenesis but that's really a process from where the life started from "Inorganic matter" and then the evolution took place, right? My question is, what triggered that process? Isn't it pretty much like the question behind Big Bang theory?

What triggered evolution? Nothing 'triggered' it or ordered it to start. It's a natural process that just happens. If an animal was traits that don't help it to survive then natural selection results in the weakest dying and those with more favourable genes reproducing thus increasing the likelihood of survival.

Actually i was talking about Abiogenesis and not evolution. The point is, Science may be able to provide an answer to how but "why" cannot be answered, at least using proofs. Big Bang is a classic example. What triggered big bang? a release of energy so enormous that our whole universe was formed from it. Something/someone must have triggered it.

You said "it just happens" You cannot say that when you're debating lol. How can anything "just" happen to be in our materialistic world, everything has a source in this universe, for at least what we know of. Water for example, it came from Oxygen and Hydrogen, hydrogen and Oxygen were formed due to the big bang...

Edited March 2, 2013 by shad0wboss

[Award Winning Boss]

No but today we often break it into a theist/faith camp and then an atheist/ rationalist camp. In the western world, they don't reconcile much.

What's your understanding of rationalism?

What triggered evolution? Nothing 'triggered' it or ordered it to start. It's a natural process that just happens. If an animal was traits that don't help it to survive then natural selection results in the weakest dying and those with more favourable genes reproducing thus increasing the likelihood of survival.

Actually i was talking about Abiogenesis and not evolution. The point is, Science may be able to provide an answer to how but "why" cannot be answered, at least using proofs. Big Bang is a classic example. What triggered big bang? a release of energy so enormous that our whole universe was formed from it. Something/someone must have triggered it.

You said "it just happens" You cannot say that when you're debating lol. Either you retire from the topic or provide evidence for it. At least that's what theists are blamed for, for not providing evidence. How can anything "just" happen to be in our materialistic world, everything has a source in this universe, for at least what we know of. Water for example, it came from Oxygen and Hydrogen, hydrogen and Oxygen were formed due to the big bang...

There doesn't need to be a 'why'. Otherwise you're only going to believe in the answer you want to be. It's like saying there's always an answer to 'what is the meaning of life?' without noticing you've presupposed that there is a meaning to be found. Moreover, why does anything have to have triggered the big bag? The universe is under the law of cause and effect (mostly anyway). But outside of the universe, that law needn't exist meaning the beginning of the universe may have been acausal. But that's just one argument that I'm not necessarily supporting. Furthermore, what's wrong with saying 'I don't know'? The God hypothesis doesn't really answer anything to me. And why must it be a theist God anyway?

What's your understanding of evolution? You are continuously misunderstanding what I'm saying. Evolution is a naturally occurring process. It is what happens when species exist. Read more about it yourself. In regards to abiogenesis, read about the basic concept of that too. You're asking for the source of abiogenesis... what does that even mean?

[Nabz]

No but today we often break it into a theist/faith camp and then an atheist/ rationalist camp. In the western world, they don't reconcile much.

What's your understanding of rationalism?

What triggered evolution? Nothing 'triggered' it or ordered it to start. It's a natural process that just happens. If an animal was traits that don't help it to survive then natural selection results in the weakest dying and those with more favourable genes reproducing thus increasing the likelihood of survival.

Actually i was talking about Abiogenesis and not evolution. The point is, Science may be able to provide an answer to how but "why" cannot be answered, at least using proofs. Big Bang is a classic example. What triggered big bang? a release of energy so enormous that our whole universe was formed from it. Something/someone must have triggered it.

You said "it just happens" You cannot say that when you're debating lol. Either you retire from the topic or provide evidence for it. At least that's what theists are blamed for, for not providing evidence. How can anything "just" happen to be in our materialistic world, everything has a source in this universe, for at least what we know of. Water for example, it came from Oxygen and Hydrogen, hydrogen and Oxygen were formed due to the big bang...

There doesn't need to be a 'why'. Otherwise you're only going to believe in the answer you want to be. It's like saying there's always an answer to 'what is the meaning of life?' without noticing you've presupposed that there is a meaning to be found. Moreover, why does anything have to have triggered the big bag? The universe is under the law of cause and effect (mostly anyway). But outside of the universe, that law needn't exist meaning the beginning of the universe may have been acausal. But that's just one argument that I'm not necessarily supporting. Furthermore, what's wrong with saying 'I don't know'? The God hypothesis doesn't really answer anything to me. And why must it be a theist God anyway?

What's your understanding of evolution? You are continuously misunderstanding what I'm saying. Evolution is a naturally occurring process. It is what happens when species exist. Read more about it yourself. In regards to abiogenesis, read about the basic concept of that too. You're asking for the source of abiogenesis... what does that even mean?

Forget evolution and all that for now.

Ok so now you're at a point where you're arguing about your own reasoning. What you just said is pretty much what a theist says about the existence of God that it's just there. You said "why does anything have to have triggered the big bag?", why do you say that it's a natural phenomenon? What made you think that way? lack of evidence/proof?

Edited March 2, 2013 by shad0wboss

[Award Winning Boss]

Forget evolution and all that for now.

Ok so now you're at a point where you're arguing about your own reasoning. What you just said is pretty much what a theist says about the existence of God that it's just there. You said "why does anything have to have triggered the big bag?", why do you say that it's a natural phenomenon? What made you think that way? lack of evidence/proof?

Right.... I haven't claimed the universe is 'just there'. (seeing as you told me to ignore evolution for now, I'll assume it's in reference to the universe.) I said it's existence could have been acausal. Where did the words 'natural phenomenon' come into play about the existence of the universe?

Jesus Christ, you're a pro at building strawmen.

[Nabz]

Forget evolution and all that for now.

Ok so now you're at a point where you're arguing about your own reasoning. What you just said is pretty much what a theist says about the existence of God that it's just there. You said "why does anything have to have triggered the big bag?", why do you say that it's a natural phenomenon? What made you think that way? lack of evidence/proof?

Right.... I haven't claimed the universe is 'just there'. (seeing as you told me to ignore evolution for now, I'll assume it's in reference to the universe.) I said it's existence could have been acausal. Where did the words 'natural phenomenon' come into play about the existence of the universe?

Jesus Christ, you're a pro at building strawmen.

Is that a compliment?

Well at least we call it "natural" whatever happens with no apparent cause. You may call it "acausal", being a non believer of God's existence. I think "God" has given us brain to find his/her/its existence really :/ Otherwise there's really no purpose of us having a brain LOL. Surely brain isn't there to think of ways how one can make money.

nuff said

Edited March 2, 2013 by shad0wboss

[Waterpolofreak]

If anyone out there doesn't believe in God, why?

Because at the age I am at, I don't feel ready to make that kind of a decision in my life yet

maybe in 20, 30 years, but for right now I am content to learn what I can in life

[krystinawashereXD]

nope, I don't think I believe in God.

It's just all of the stuff that's happened to me makes

me doubt that there is a higher power that is out there.

and of all of the things that I've heard from the bible, I don't

think that some of the stuff is right, and I just don't accept religion

at all, I guess.

and based on how some people act, (they justify wrong actions

because of their religion) I just don't believe in it.

[Luka Petrovic]

nope, I don't think I believe in God.

It's just all of the stuff that's happened to me makes

me doubt that there is a higher power that is out there.

and of all of the things that I've heard from the bible, I don't

think that some of the stuff is right, and I just don't accept religion

at all, I guess.

and based on how some people act, (they justify wrong actions

because of their religion) I just don't believe in it.

What is in the bible that turns you away from religion, and if Christianity isn't of your taste, perhaps something else? And people act in similar ways without religion, personally I've never bought into the argument by either religious people or atheists that one or the other has caused more deaths... Both have been used for destruction

[krystinawashereXD]

nope, I don't think I believe in God.

It's just all of the stuff that's happened to me makes

me doubt that there is a higher power that is out there.

and of all of the things that I've heard from the bible, I don't

think that some of the stuff is right, and I just don't accept religion

at all, I guess.

and based on how some people act, (they justify wrong actions

because of their religion) I just don't believe in it.

What is in the bible that turns you away from religion, and if Christianity isn't of your taste, perhaps something else? And people act in similar ways without religion, personally I've never bought into the argument by either religious people or atheists that one or the other has caused more deaths... Both have been used for destruction

I mean, the whole

Sodom and Gomorrah story in the Bible. I haven't read the bible, but I have heard of that story. God killed a mass of homosexuals. Why? Why did he do that? And I mean, I'm not trying to bash on christianity, but I just don't agree with it,. And I understand what you mean by both have been used for destruction, but I'm saying that (for example) some wars that have been fought, over religion. I just don't agree to it, I guess

[Nabz]

read the posts from the beginning. You will pretty much be satisfied, either falling on the non believing side or the believing side...

nope, I don't think I believe in God.
It's just all of the stuff that's happened to me makes
me doubt that there is a higher power that is out there.
and of all of the things that I've heard from the bible, I don't
think that some of the stuff is right, and I just don't accept religion
at all, I guess.

and based on how some people act, (they justify wrong actions
because of their religion) I just don't believe in it.

What is in the bible that turns you away from religion, and if Christianity isn't of your taste, perhaps something else? And people act in similar ways without religion, personally I've never bought into the argument by either religious people or atheists that one or the other has caused more deaths... Both have been used for destruction

I mean, the whole

Sodom and Gomorrah story in the Bible. I haven't read the bible, but I have heard of that story. God killed a mass of homosexuals. Why? Why did he do that? And I mean, I'm not trying to bash on christianity, but I just don't agree with it,. And I understand what you mean by both have been used for destruction, but I'm saying that (for example) some wars that have been fought, over religion. I just don't agree to it, I guess

Uhm, so you're saying that killing a bunch of homosexual was wrong? Well, people are hanged, killed everyday due to the crimes they are guilty of, would you go and argue about that as well?

Edited March 13, 2013 by shad0wboss

[Luka Petrovic]

nope, I don't think I believe in God.

It's just all of the stuff that's happened to me makes

me doubt that there is a higher power that is out there.

and of all of the things that I've heard from the bible, I don't

think that some of the stuff is right, and I just don't accept religion

at all, I guess.

and based on how some people act, (they justify wrong actions

because of their religion) I just don't believe in it.

What is in the bible that turns you away from religion, and if Christianity isn't of your taste, perhaps something else? And people act in similar ways without religion, personally I've never bought into the argument by either religious people or atheists that one or the other has caused more deaths... Both have been used for destruction

I mean, the whole

Sodom and Gomorrah story in the Bible. I haven't read the bible, but I have heard of that story. God killed a mass of homosexuals. Why? Why did he do that? And I mean, I'm not trying to bash on christianity, but I just don't agree with it,. And I understand what you mean by both have been used for destruction, but I'm saying that (for example) some wars that have been fought, over religion. I just don't agree to it, I guess

Well homosexuality was one of the many sins committed by those in Sodom and Gomorrah, no one should really be obliterated for that... And a lot of the violence and injustice found in the bible is in the Old Testament. Well then you might ask, why would Christian's even read these books. Well it's because of Jewish origins of the religion. For morality one should actually look to the New Testament as it was a revolution in moral thought and ethics. For example in changed from the Old Testament "eye for an eye" to " turn the other cheek." The Old Testament has limited use and it is often mis-used by fundamentalists for excuse to stone, burn or smite people who are different. Essentially the Old Testament is old news.

[Guest]

Found a really good quote. Explains why I don't believe in god perfectly.

"I'm sorry if my atheism offends you. But guess what - your religious wars, jihads, crusades, inquisitions, censoring of free speech, brainwashing of children, murdering of albinos, forcing girls into underage marriages, female genital mutilation, stoning, pederasty, homophobia, and rejection of science and reason offends me. So, I guess we're even."

Mike Treder