3 questions about university studies in Scotland

[Tilia]

So I graduated this spring and have decided to apply for universities in Scotland. I'm going to study some sort of chemistry, but I need some guidance to this weird educational system. I'm not at all familiar with the British school system and will probably ask very stupid questinos, but please answer them anyway.

In my country you start with doing a 3-year course leading to a bachelor's degree. After that you apply for another 2-year course, giving you a masters degree. But when I look at UCAS, it seems that you apply for one or the other and can apply directly for a master's course, if you wish. How does that work? I'm very confused. What should I apply for?

Secondly, many universities offer entry into second year. Since my grades are good enough and I feel very old compared to everyone else here, I'd like to go for that. In that case I'll only be 1-2 years older than the others, instead of 2-3 years. What will I miss during the first year? Is it an disadvantage going directly to second year in any sense? Will I miss alot of social things? The idea of coming to a class where everyone already know each other very well and don't want to get to know any foreigner is not to appealing, and I'm not exactly the world's most social being.

Thirdly, I meet all the requirements, but the universities require some sort of English course, like a 4 at SL. I did not take English, so I don't have that. But obviously I can speak English and I did take 2 national courses, equivalent to English SL. I'm also taking a short university course in English culture now. So is there anyway to get around this? I don't really feel like paying 150 euro to do a TOEFL test or anything.

Thanks for your help!

[Cynthia]

In my country you start with doing a 3-year course leading to a bachelor's degree. After that you apply for another 2-year course, giving you a masters degree. But when I look at UCAS, it seems that you apply for one or the other and can apply directly for a master's course, if you wish. How does that work? I'm very confused. What should I apply for?

It is rather similar - you need to do a bachelor's degree first and then apply for a master's. Some courses in Scotland are archaically called MA/MSc although they are Bachelor's degrees.

Secondly, many universities offer entry into second year. Since my grades are good enough and I feel very old compared to everyone else here, I'd like to go for that. In that case I'll only be 1-2 years older than the others, instead of 2-3 years. What will I miss during the first year? Is it an disadvantage going directly to second year in any sense? Will I miss alot of social things? The idea of coming to a class where everyone already know each other very well and don't want to get to know any foreigner is not to appealing, and I'm not exactly the world's most social being.

This is something you need to think about - usually it's not advised to skip the first year because you miss course content and ofc the social side. There should be many mature students in Scotland anyway and you won't need to pay the 3k

Thirdly, I meet all the requirements, but the universities require some sort of English course, like a 4 at SL. I did not take English, so I don't have that. But obviously I can speak English and I did take 2 national courses, equivalent to English SL. I'm also taking a short university course in English culture now. So is there anyway to get around this? I don't really feel like paying 150 euro to do a TOEFL test or anything.

I assume you have the bilingual diploma? That should be enough proof of English language proficiency

[Tilia]

In my country you start with doing a 3-year course leading to a bachelor's degree. After that you apply for another 2-year course, giving you a masters degree. But when I look at UCAS, it seems that you apply for one or the other and can apply directly for a master's course, if you wish. How does that work? I'm very confused. What should I apply for?

It is rather similar - you need to do a bachelor's degree first and then apply for a master's. Some courses in Scotland are archaically called MA/MSc although they are Bachelor's degrees.

But how can that be? According to UCAS a Hon Bsc degree is 4 years and a Hon MChem degree is 5 years. You don't study for nine years to get a master's degree, or do you?

Thirdly, I meet all the requirements, but the universities require some sort of English course, like a 4 at SL. I did not take English, so I don't have that. But obviously I can speak English and I did take 2 national courses, equivalent to English SL. I'm also taking a short university course in English culture now. So is there anyway to get around this? I don't really feel like paying 150 euro to do a TOEFL test or anything.

I assume you have the bilingual diploma? That should be enough proof of English language proficiency

Is that really? It said bilingual diploma on the results page, but is that enough? Feels very stupid if my choice to take German would prevent me from studying in Scotland.

Edited September 6, 2010 by Tilia

[Cynthia]

But how can that be? According to UCAS a Hon Bsc degree is 4 years and a Hon MChem degree is 5 years. You don't study for nine years to get a master's degree, or do you?

Ah, I assume MChem includes the undergraduate studies as well It's sometimes like that in sciences it seems.

Is that really? It said bilingual diploma on the results page, but is that enough? Feels very stupid if my choice to take German would prevent me from studying in Scotland.

Yes, I think so! You should email the universities in question to make sure but usually it should be

[Sandwich]

If it helps, I agree with what Cynthia is saying. A bilingual diploma is sufficient proof that you are fluent in English and the difference between the Masters and Bachelors isn't an additional 5 years, it's just an extra year -- you either do one or the other. I suspect they're very similar and you can flick around between them. You should be able to discuss with your professors and swap up or down.

I'm not 100% familiar with the Scottish University system and these things differ slightly between some Universities in any case, but I think that should all be correct.

I've also not heard of skipping a year. I'm not sure you can do it in England, so I'm afraid I can't be helpful there! I don't think age is a big deal (there are people of all ages on Undergrad/Postgrad courses) but of course you'd miss out on being a Fresher and would have to infiltrate a cohort as opposed to being automatically part of one. Personally I would say it's probably not the best idea to skip a year but that's solely on the basis of student experience. You should perhaps email or ring the departments you're interested in and ask what sort of content is covered in the first year and see whether you really think you're okay to skip. It does seem a little weird -- if skipping is easy and for A-Level/IB/Scots Higher level knowledge of Chemistry I doubt they'd really have any uptake at all for 1st year Chemistry!

[Chocaholic]

In Canada sometimes universities, depending on your grades, will let you skip a year. For example, McGill forces you to skip a year. So I'm sure it's possible in Scotland. But, I wouldn't recommend it as you miss key information that was not introduced in the IB as it is VERY similar to a first year university course, but not identical. Therefore, your GPA in your second year would be lower.

[Sandwich]

In Canada sometimes universities, depending on your grades, will let you skip a year. For example, McGill forces you to skip a year. So I'm sure it's possible in Scotland. But, I wouldn't recommend it as you miss key information that was not introduced in the IB as it is VERY similar to a first year university course, but not identical. Therefore, your GPA in your second year would be lower.

The Canadian/American system is very different from the British systems, though. The British University courses are typically set to be one higher from school, no matter what the subject, and there's no such thing as a GPA. There's usually no such thing as being able to use your school courses to skip Uni courses.... largely because if Uni courses aren't one step higher/more advanced, what's the point? 100% of people would just march straight into the second year.

I know people skip years and courses using school grades in other places in the world, but purely because that's atypical (to my knowledge!) for the system in England and I always thought the same for Scotland, I think it's worth checking.

[Tilia]

So, thanks for all your answers.

Have I now understood this correctly:

I apply to either Bsc (4 years) or Hon sc (5 years) and it's not unlikely that I may be able to switch between them once I've started? And if I choose Bsc and graduate, I then study one additional year to get a master's degree?

Edited September 10, 2010 by Tilia

[Sandwich]

^^ To the best of my knowledge, yes. The way to know for sure would be to ring/email them and just confirm that this is the case. Or alternatively just to play it safe and go straight for the Masters one because it's always going to be easier to switch down than up